Hold up just a minute. This is Chase and I am here with Derek Evans via the Subway satellite phone. Did you know that we sponsored by Subway? Uh, no. But , I'm sure that joke will take us just a foot further. Uh, I see what you did there. Only 5, 5, 5 Thatt. Put that in there. Yeah. No, it's gonna stay, it's gotta,  , subway's kind of trash, so we don't, we're not gonna go.  Plenty of inappropriate jokes came to mind. Yeah, yeah. Well, we left those in our brink episode. , how do you think we did for Brink? Hey, I had a great time with y'all. Yeah,  it was a fun watch. Definitely pulling back the nostalgia curtain on that one.

, but we're bringing you here today 'cause I want to talk to you a little bit more about your directorial debut , we had a phone conversation not too long ago. I don't know if you remember this, but. , I was kind of fishing for some advice as someone who has directed before and kind of wants to get back in the chair, , but doesn't really know where to begin.

You, you had a line on that phone call where you said the reason you were successful was because you were dumb. Do you remember that? Yeah. I said, uh, how could I forget?  , I told you that  I'm probably , the world's bravest idiot. Yeah.  And I think about that line every day that, I mean, this call was like, what, A month ago?

Or something like that. And I don't know. It's, I was inebriated. I have no idea. Oh God.  But  I think that is a very interesting thing to talk about.  I know a lot of people listening to this probably haven't jumped in the film world, and if they have that's amazing and you know, more power to 'em.

But there's something very interesting about saying, Hey, I was really stupid or really dumb, and that's what got me where I am. And yeah. And I wanna dive deeper into that. So let, let's trace it all the way back. 

So, , your first feature film. Let's go back and let's talk about that.  I want to kind of talk about the process and I don't wanna talk about the process in a way that most people talk about it. Like when you, you watch these interviews where they go, this is how we filmed it.

You know, we had to do this overnight. I just wanna, I wanna know about your thought process in the very, very beginning of this film. Yeah, for sure. , my, my first film I. Was my first feature, , the king of bloody folk in Britain. And , not a lot of people know that , and, you know, , poor PR on my part.

,  you know , what's interesting about it? , and for anybody listening right now, , it's publicly available.  If you, , are in Europe, you can find it on DVD.  If you are, , in the us, , you can find it on Amazon, apple tv, et cetera. And if you wanna watch it for free in seven 20 p and, uh, make sure that my distributor.

Get some money. , you can find it on Tubi. , you just redeemed yourself with the marketing. Oh yeah. There we go. , it was my first film, genuinely  that was the first one. So  I didn't actually go for shorts before I started wanting to make my own movies. I went for, um, a feature, 

you know, o other than,  doing  little films  as a kid with my cousins on a high eight camera recorder.  If those count, and maybe they do in some world, , then it's not my first film. I had made plenty of films, but I did not go to school for filming, per se. I actually went to school for acting and I acted in some films, which is where I got , some experience , doing actual on-camera work with a, you know.

For scripted, for a scripted narrative film. . There's so many great directors out there that didn't go to school for filmmaking or No, you know, just kind picked it up way I wish I, I had done something exactly  and I wish I had done something related to it looking back. I'm like, well, dang, I paid for school.

 I don't regret going to school , for acting. , I met some of my best friends. I met , my now wife and, , and  I don't regret it at all. That actually it laid a very strong foundation going to school  for acting and specifically for theater acting , at Northern Kentucky University.

And, , it's where I met Kyle, , Kyle Gaskin, who's on this podcast. , it's where I met Andrew Weiman, who was also on this podcast.  It was a good program that we were in for, uh, for theater acting. , and I think that , it did push me, , because, you know, I would.

Still not a, I wouldn't call myself a great actor, but like , I wanna be.  And I think  that school gave me a foundation for storytelling and that was important. While I was there, I learned screenwriting. I took a screenwriting class from Ken Jones. He was the head of the theater department at the time, and Ken Jones.

 He's not necessarily a household name, but he's an award-winning playwright. And, and, and, you know, screenwriter, he wrote for, , recess, , Saturday morning cartoons. You know,  the kindergartners were based on his do daughters, uh, Ken Jones's, and, uh, at least so I've been told and, , and whatnot.

, but, , maybe our next review down the road is a few episodes of recess. Oh, I'm there for it.  Anytime We could call Ken. We can get Ken on here. Yeah, that would, and, um, you heard it here and so Yeah. You heard it here, folks. , but,  I got a taste for screenwriting , from, , Ken Jones.

And, , so I wrote. In college , I had,  I started writing, , a script, which , I've never produced. I would love to one day it, it needs a lot of work still, but it's called Dustland in, you know, 1950s. , follows some farmer kids,  from the fifties  and new New Mexico during,  during what was , a second dust bowl 

 E either way,  I got that taste , for filmmaking , in school. And I knew I wanted to do filmmaking, but I was in school in northern Kentucky and I had plans to move to la , after I graduated college, it never happened. I actually ended up moving straight to Atlanta, Georgia, which I.

Also do not regret at all.  We moved here, me and my wife at the time, still girlfriend, but we moved here in late 2014. And in 2015, , I signed with my first agent, Howton Talent. Here I. And, , started working, , as a professional actor. , I didn't book anything big until 2017, but before that I was, ,  eager to be on set and work in general, so late 2014, early 2015.

Maybe it was May, maybe it was mainly just late 2014. Now that I'm thinking about it, , I started working as an extra onset and I worked on lots of things. I met some of my best friends , in Atlanta. I. Working as an extra on set.  I worked on a show called Powers. We were on,  one of those divergent series.

Who knows which one. , I had, , done the Walking Dead. I had, , been an extra in, . I feel like if you're an actor in Atlanta, you've been on The Walking Dead at some point or another, at some point it gets us off. It gets us off. I've met so many people that have been an extra on Walking Dead, which it makes sense in how many extras they need.

Yeah. Oh yeah.  Which season? Oh, I couldn't tell you. Oh, you know what? No, , I can. Season five. Oh, that was before It became shit, right? Before it became a wild thing. Yeah. Yeah. , I am in now  as a,  actual actor a scene with,  Maggie kills me  in season 11. , , but it took some years to get there, , and all that leading up to say that, you know, when I had signed with my first agent, it took two years to, to book my first TV show, which was being Mary Jane.

I ended up doing eight episodes , on that show, and before that I was eager to be doing some actual, you know, acting on . A movie and I had always, I've always wanted to make movies.  I've always wanted to be a director since I was a kid, you know, and I did make movies as a kid growing up.

Little Chin puppet movie I made, , called Chin Mania. Made a, uh, magic man. Origin story, which was, you know, an origin story for The Magic Man, which The Magic Man  was a movie my older cousins had made where,  my cousin Josh would snap his fingers and, and things would appear in his hand or his clothes would disappear  or something.

And I thought, how cool is that? They were just doing that simple, , stop the camera, move something around, restart the camera, and then , the practical in-camera effect of he snapped his fingers and something happened. And I thought that's great. And I made a little origin story, which was cheesy and embarrassing.

, god forbid anybody nowadays see it.  And one day when you become famous that  it'll be in your collector's edition like boxing. It'll be perfect. Yeah., it'll be perfect. Yes. And,  it was none of it was scripted. We were just winging it all by the seat of our pants filming on the little high eight camera.

I, I had done some stop motion stuff.  Playing with some clay and, , that was it. But  I wanted to be a director. I've always wanted to, and so I thought, Hey, nobody's put me in their films as a, as an actual actor right now. , why don't we just, , me talking with me and my group of extra friends, like, Hey, let's get together and let's make.

Let's make a feature film. And I was like,  I've got an idea. I'm  I've been inspired to write a script. I think it'll be something that we could film right now for like next to no money with just what we have here and it'll be fun. And they're like, that sounds great. I was like, gimme some time to finish up this script and we'll see what it's about.

And so that was, you know me, I'm talking with my buddy Julio Liverpool, my buddy Jake Richens, my buddy Pedro,  Hoyos. , and Pedro told me, he's like, Hey, look, , once you get this script going, there's a guy in town, , he's won a couple of, , think Time Emmys, but you know Emmys and, , his name's Julio Riga.

 , I'll introduce you to him and, , we'll see what's up. So I started working on the script. And where I say that I was the bravest idiot, we all were, , the, this entire ragtag group of people that made this film, , were just brave idiots because what it ended up being was probably the biggest script I had.

And I, which the bar wasn't high. I'd only written two before that. Right. But this is,  not spoiling it out there for anybody, but this is like, what, an hour and 36 minute runtime for this. It's a full, it's a full length feature. Yeah. First, I mean, to go from nothing to that kind level. 'cause .

Kind of gloss around it, but a lot of people. Write shorts, or they write their first feature's only an hour, hour 10. They don't really go that full distance, you know? 'cause that is, you know, full, full, full length. That is, that's what you're expecting.  Now everyone's expecting three to three and a half hours, which is getting ridiculous.

But, . An hour and a half is a perfect horror movie. It ended up being the biggest film, , I had ever written. , coming in at 140 pages. And, , had 93 locations, 85 actors, 150 something props. I mean, absolutely ridiculous.  If I had looked at that script. Now, knowing what I know now, , I would never have made it.

,  that's not me. Hyperbolizing, that's wisdom. Yeah. And what makes that kind of crazy is that I would never have made that film if I knew what I know now and which is, , maybe a little embarrassing in some ways.  I don't know, but I look back and I say, kid, you are fucking nuts.

And I had plenty of people tell me that at the time, but guess what?  I didn't wanna hear that. I just wanted to say, well, I'll prove you wrong then.  And if you believed in me, great. Come along. ,  you talk about like what we know now.  We're in our thirties now, so it's what we know now is we know like life and death.

We know that  the day in, day out,  grog of life, we know that we have to go to work, we have to make money, we have to do this, we have to have this like comfortable net around us. There's something about being dumb  and unaware of all  that kind of breaks you free of those chains  Oh, yeah.

. And  I was surrounded by a team of people that wanted to see it through to the end as well. And we didn't know how we were gonna do it, just that we were going to do it.

So we started casting it in. So I finished the script in 2015. I was 23 years old at the time, I think. And, , over 10 years ago now, which is, that's insanity. , he, , where does the time go? , it's stupid. And,  and so I finished the script and I took it to Julio. But Hughes, you know. He was who my buddy Pedro had introduced me to.

And,  I read him just, , a couple of pages of the script and he said, absolutely, I wanna be a part of it. And with , the film would never have been made without Julio. , I brought him on, , as a DP and as a co-director and as a co-producer. , he was invaluable to the entire process.

, Julio Riga, , brought on the cameras. , he brought on some gears, some lights, and, , a tenacity to want to get it done. He helped break down the entire script, which was completely necessary. I mean, like I said, 93 locations, 85,  actors not including the extras.  Including the extras, there are probably over 120 people.

I also wanna talk, I want to like kind of round back, 'cause now I'm getting interested because let's talk about dumb for a second. , sure. You wrote , a movie based in Britain. And you're gonna film it , in Atlanta, , and pulled it off somehow. Like that, that that is something to some, yeah. Yeah. But to others, maybe not, but you know, somebody's out there Eagle eye it, but those people can go to hell.

, I love them to death. They're the ones giving you the one. Star review. , yeah, I, but I hope they're watching it on Amazon and they're at least giving me a dollar. That's, if they're watching it on tub, being shitting, dang, dang damn. Like they got me now they can go to hell. ,  I mean it's what an accomplishment , and I don't mean it as like in a negative way, it's just thinking on that level of you really went in with no bounds.

It somebody who's 20. No, it's crazy. Three. And did you ever have imposter syndrome while doing this? Not while doing it, no. I think I was so blinded by wanting to prove I could,   I thought we were gonna really make something. And we did make it, and it took a long time and we'll get into that I'm sure.

 'cause it was not an overnight process by any means. , but we were able to do it by the end. And , to do that film that is, ,  a testament to everybody who was a part of that.  I carried a big burden , on the hats that I wore, but everybody did, you know?

Yeah. I mean. I led the film, so I was a lead actor in it. 'cause I wanted to write a film to put myself in. Yeah, it's, it's selfish,  in a way. But,  to get going , in this career, , you have to have something. You'll not get booked in something unless you have something. So there's a catch 22 for everything about the film industry and  , a lot of this industry is , in some turmoil and changing right now and things are.

Who knows what things are gonna look like, but I know one thing's for sure is  that catch will always be there. , you know that you have to have a resume to get in and you have to be in to build the resume. It's a weird thing,  

is there a correlation to that kid that made the origin story to the magic man?



, there's a lot of that kid still there of just sort of pushing into this. I don't know what it is, but I'm gonna figure it out space, and I don't know how I'll figure it out. I just know that I have the ability to. Other people have done it, I can do it too. , and that, that was the kind of impetus for me and for everybody , who came on to help build this film, , and it, and once again, , all set in a foreign country, how old were you gonna do this?

So what we started by doing was saying, Hey, well let's film like a little proof of concept video. So we cast the main characters, I think in June of. Of 2015 possibly. And we filmed a little proof of concept video, just a small thing to do, a little Indiegogo fundraiser for the film. And we raised on Indiegogo about three and a half thousand dollars.

So not much at all. , but we thought, holy cow, this is great. , people believe in us. And  I think. 1000 of that was from my uncle Brian and Aunt Diane. And then, , a thousand of that was from, , a buddy rc. And so the other 1500 were from random people. And that was great, you know, and maybe some of them , were people who worked on the film with us.

Yeah,  that's still belief, man. Belief comes, it doesn't matter if it's from an ant or someone 14,000 miles away. , belief is belief and it can generate so much. It's crazy. And so we started casting the characters for the film. And as we started casting all these, , we filmed the proof of concept.

We made that, and we raised that funding. We knew it was gonna cost a little bit more for the film, but Julio and I were willing to put up , our own money to do it, and we started casting the rest of the characters for the film. We set a date. I remember that, that was important for us. We said, okay, well what's the first day of filming?

And. , I think originally we had set it for August and we ended up moving it, , but we eventually landed on September, either the 20th or September 21st was one or the other. I think it might've been the 21st. , as the first day of filming. We broke it all down. , we scheduled it all out. Julio and myself, , we eventually brought on an ad after the fact, mito, who was invaluable to the process as well.

, but Julio and I broke down the entire schedule. I have to say, this was before ai, this was before I knew what that software existed that would make this easier even. , I. Broke down the schedules for the actors with Julio  and to be honest, the schedules might have been something I actually, I spearheaded mainly myself, but just to say, Hey,  how am I bringing in these people?

Because we ended up getting so many submissions for the film. It was like 600 to a thousand people that submitted to be in the film. And, . We ended up casting people from New York, from la, from North Carolina, Mississippi,  Cincinnati, , I think Florida as well, , South Carolina. , so from all over.

, and was this a film that everybody got paid for and so No. So nobody made money, , to work on the film. , we had to , pay for some travel , and some stipends here and there, but everybody came and volunteered to be on the film from the crew to the cast, and that is something that I.

Like, I'll never, I'd never be able to pull that off again. One, I wouldn't feel comfortable asking anybody to ever do that again. I wouldn't feel comfortable, , making everyone do that again. You know? , not that we made anybody do anything. People wanted to be a part of it. I remember people telling me, they're like, I saw the title for this, and I thought, what is that?

And I clicked on it and I thought, I need to be a part of that film. And ,  I can remember my villain, who was super important to me to have Mike Sch, who plays,  Clarence. Clarence, his first and last name are the same. I. And,  Mr. Clarence has played by Mike Schumer. I remember seeing him in a play in Cincinnati, which is, , the big city where , I'm actually from Northern Kentucky, , but I grew up near Cincinnati, so I claim that as home.

And, , I saw Mike Sch near Kyle, right? Yeah. And Kyle, same place. Exactly. And I saw Mike sch in a play and I thought, holy cow, that guy is incredible. And, , I hit up the director of the play 'cause he was a friend of mine. His name's Kevin Crowley., Kevin's, , Cincinnati famous, even more than that.

He's, he was in Second City with Steve Corll and,  et cetera. He's a funny guy and talented, , actor and director. And Kevin. I was like, Kevin, yo, what is. I need this guy's info. Can you please forward it to me? 'cause I wanna send him a script. And he sent it to me and I didn't even have the script finished.

 When I approached Mike, , I was nervous as hell. I sent him 110 pages of a hundred and what eventually became the 140 page script. That's your next,  dumb move too, is pitching a script without being finished. There was no ending. Yeah, , I remember saying. There's gonna be a big old blah, blah, blah.

I don't wanna spoil it for anybody who hasn't seen it and for the ending, but I told him, but look, dude, this is 110 page. I was like, Hey man, I know you don't know me, but I know Kevin, , and I wrote this role for you in a film, , and I have the script attached. It's not finished. There's a big old blah, blah, blah at the end, and I just wanted to get it to you to see if maybe you could figure it out.

We're planning to film it in Atlanta. , and let me know what you think. , and Mike emailed me back , and he was like, yeah, let's do it, man. And , I was like, hell yeah. I felt so empowered. Once Mike came on board, to be honest,  that was a win for me. I reached out to an actor I had no contact with and he wanted to do it.

That gave me a lot of. It gave me a lot of confidence, to be honest,  that maybe we could get more people on board, right. And , that fearless thing we talk about, , like just reaching out with no, with an unfinished script and , oh yeah, this is nothing but air and opportunity. , oh yeah.

You know, my buddy Jordan has told me something, , that has always stuck with me is, , , it's pure wisdom. Let them tell you no. Yeah. And that's an important thing to hold onto when you're being an a brave idiot, is to let them tell you no, you know? And that pitch, pitch your heart out. Yeah. See what they say.

 We are talking film here, but  that's an everyday life thing  if you're working in sales out there or you are, , just selling yourself for a new job or. , selling yourself on a date, , , it is the same concept is sometimes we get too caught up in our own mind about what we know can go wrong Sometimes you just gotta clear it, be an idiot, and let it go, and just sell yourself.

And if you're able to do that and  knock down those barriers, you can accomplish anything. Absolutely. And so many people out there accomplish so many great things. Oh yeah. , without any knowledge of any of this. You gotta get started, you gotta get started somewhere.  You do have the education , being an actor still kind of gets you in that world, but at the same time, it's still that just go for broke kind of attitude that a lot of people are missing.

And as we get older, it feels like. At least for me, that attitude feels like it's dwindling by the second. Yeah.  Because of the fear of what can happen . Yeah. Well, I remember, the medicine to swallow for that is that you set a date and you say, that's the date we're getting it done.

We did, we set the 21st, or like I said, it was either the 25th, 21st, but I'm more likely to believe it's the 21st, , of September, 2015. And that was gonna be our first day of filming. We had to lock every location that we could down. And I say that we could, because we didn't have a lot of them locked down by the time we started filming.

Yeah. . 93 of them, we doubled up as many as we possibly could where one house served as, , three different locations or something like that. Right. , our warehouse that we filmed in had,  different rooms that looked completely different, and so it served as like three or four different places, , within the film.

, and  that kind of thing helps, , that's producing, , is figuring out how to get it done and,  and  we set the date, we cast the film. And you know what's crazy is that by the time we ended up, let's see here,  by the time we started filming that first day, I.

The only thing that went wrong that day is we showed up to our warehouse location and Clay, , I forget his last name. He owned the place and he was just not gonna be there that day. But his assistant knew that we were supposed to be there and he was there and we go to get in and there was a gate locking the warehouse.

And , we go to get his assistant and he's like, well, I know you're supposed to be here, so lemme go get the bolt cutters. And he got a bolt cutter 'cause he didn't have the key for the lock. And he cut one of the bolts on it. I saved that bolt. I have it in a frame here at the house. That bolt that we cut through was the only thing that went wrong that day.

We shot and finished everything we needed to. Like I said, I had everything storyboarded out. , we shot for multiple scenes that took place at that location. We shot the outside exterior warehouse stuff. , and we shot a solid eight hours and then, , we were done. That gave Julio and I and the team such utter confidence to complete that film.

It gave us such wind in our sails, breath in our lungs that we did it. We pulled it off because I was a nervous, such a nervous wreck. Leading up to that first day, maybe this is going back to what you're saying. , did you doubt yourself or something leading up to that first day? It did grow in intensity.

A kind of welling up inside me that, is this gonna work? There are people flying in, coming in from other places, from other parts of the world. , is this, are we gonna pull this off?  , and that first day went so well that we were like, , we can do it. And I'm glad  that was our first day because something horrible went wrong every single day of that shoot afterwards.

And we had a 48 day shoot on this film. I was awaiting tables at the time and took two months off to be able to do this. And my lovely wife, , supported us during that time because what money I had saved up was going straight into this movie.  And so something major going, you talk about belief man.

Oh yeah, right there. There's more belief  and something major went wrong every single day. I remember the second day an actor called me, , near midnight, either emailed me or called me near midnight to say that they weren't gonna show up the next day because they had booked an extras gig , on a show in town.

And I thought, Hey, I know you're not getting money  for this. , but , you've got a substantial scene with two pages of dialogue. , like I do think personally speaking,  actor to actor, this would be great for your reel. And they're like, ah, I know, but this TV show is a really big TV show and I just can't pass up the opportunity.

And I'm like, okay, I understand. Good luck. And I had to find a new actor to replace somebody with two pages of the dialogue, , at midnight to be on. , to, you know, and we were supposed to be on set at 7:00 AM the next day. And , for the entirety of that filming schedule, Julian and I both only got four hours or less of sleep every single night.

, we shot, you know, five to six days a week, you know, 48 days. And then we did 12 days of pickups over the two years following that. But by the end of that 48 days, we had shot a feature film with a few things left to pick up.  Very small things, but we made it. We made it to the end and we shot the film for around seven grand.

That seven grand went into so impressive though. It's crazy   seven grand didn't get you a lot now, I mean, especially now, like fast forward 10 years, like, you know, oh yeah. In 20 14, 20 15, that would've, yeah, that's a huge stream budget. Well, did I did the math,  El Mariachi was shot for seven grand in the nineties, but,  considering inflation, it was, it would be more than what we shot the king for.

, and it was a lot, it was a lot to do. There was a lot that went wrong. I'm not saying I did everything perfectly either. , I'd be a fool to say that. , but , I do think that we pulled off something that not a lot of people do. Not that they can't, I think many people can.

But it's difficult and it is difficult to rally people up, to show up for no money. At the time things economically weren't quite like they are. It's probably gotten tougher to do something like that. , but , yeah, I mean, even recently as Covid, yeah, , it's been hard 'cause a lot of people. I don't wanna say a lot of people have left dreams to die.

'cause I think  that's a little harsh and melodramatic. Mm-hmm. But it just feels more and more that like a lot of people put 'em on the back burner for so long and then you wake up one day. Because, , you were thinking about the logical things your whole life and then you wake up , and 10, 15 years is gone and those dreams are cold as ice, you know?

 And that's what inspired me about being dumb. And it's like, how do I go back to being dumb again? 'cause when we're full of piss and vinegar, when we're in our early twenties, we think we can just, we're superman. We're arrogant and just arrogant .

You know what's crazy though? I think. And I hope this isn't my last, I hope the king is not my last film. , I've been working on some shorts  and  I'm working on a couple features too at the moment, just in, you know, concept development  and script development stages. But,  I hope that the king's not my last, but I've heard that a lot of people, , their greatest achievements happen in their twenties.

You know,  our founding fathers ripping tea off of boats.  They were in their twenties. And um, and I think that maybe  that air, that little bit of arrogance that they, that they got the, the piss and vinegar maybe.   I wanna share the story with you and probably everyone out there, , I'm  nowhere near as accomplished as you.  I got like a late, late, late, late start into trying to do anything film related without growing up in it. Other than I liked movies. I liked watching them. I liked discovering new films.

 But when I got in my twenties, I was like, man, I really wanna be in this industry. I wanna be a screenwriter. Was kind of my first thought, like, I can do that. Yeah. I've written my whole life. I've published  some poems and published a couple books, so I was like, I got it. I can do it. , I had a.

Really good friend. It's sad we kinda lost touch over time, but,  just life and moving cities. But, , she lived in Nashville and she was an actress and really good one. ,  and she met these two guys on this call and they were doing a horror film  mm-hmm.

You know, small, small, small budget. I think. Each actor was getting paid $150 for it. , I didn't meet them, but they had somebody drop out , on them, , last minute, and they were like, well, we're looking for an actor to be in this film. And I thought to myself, I was like, this scares the shit outta me. I should do it.

, especially 'cause I wanted to do something like this my entire life. My brother was a stage actor and a good one. , I never acted before, , in my head I'm thinking I can read some dialogue for a little bit , and play , an extra or do this, that and the other.  And just get the experience.

It's, it's low paying, you know, like I said, we're getting paid $150 for. You know, two months worth of shooting. , it was about as long as the king. , I make it out there the first day for the table read, and they drop this huge script on me and it's all highlighted. And I'm like, what the fuck is this?

And they're like, oh yeah, you're the lead. And I'm like, have you lost your mind? But, you know,  I wasn't gonna walk away now. I'd already like put myself out there and every day I was so anxious.  Until the camera lights came on, and  , it was the best time I ever had 13 hour days like I was, wow.

I was going to work at six in the morning, getting off at three, and then immediately driving halfway across Nashville to go shoot until about  11 o'clock at night, sometimes even midnight. And then doing it all over again the next day at night. Loved every bit of it. , we got about.

A quarter of the way . And they called me one day and they were like, yeah, the land's being taken up now. , so , we're gonna have to hold off on shooting for a little bit, but we'll call you when it's ready to pick up. I was like, okay, cool. And  we shot literally all around it.

You know how everything's shot out of order, and I don't know if anybody listen to this knows that, you know, films are not shot in chronological order.  Most of the time. I'm sure that there are most of the time there, , there are some exceptions, but, , yeah, if maybe a one location you can do it.

But,  there was no ending and no beginning. And next thing I know, he calls me about a month later and he is like, Hey, the film's gonna debuted on Amazon tomorrow. And I'm like. A month later. Yeah. I was like, what movie? I was like,  we didn't shoot a movie.

But, , the whoever invested in it wanted it done and wanted it out there and they, I guess they weren't gonna get the land back. It's, yeah, I know. It's not what they envision. I don't wanna speak for the guys. 'cause they're incredible people and very hard workers.  But it didn't come out like we expected.

But  it's there. And I think to myself all the time, I'm like.  Most people haven't done that. , most people can't say that. Most people can't look at their,  face on an IMDB page.  And I was able to do that, even if that's it. And in right now, the way it's going, it could, but I still hold onto it.

I did it. And,  just to think about like in your perspective, . Only like maybe 0.001% of people get to direct multiple films. Oh yeah. And you got to do it. And I'm talking feature, I'm not talking about like grab their own camera and do it. I'm talking about an actual film that's made that's out there that's profitable.

That is. People are watching to talk about, I don't, it's not quite profitable yet, but, , , we're getting there with the dv, with the DVD sales,  it's actually getting close to being completely in the black. Yeah.  Which is unreal that a first time feature, , filmmaker gets their movie to distribution.

, and, , not the glorious theater theatrical release that everybody would hope for. But, , but distribution, nonetheless. It is. And, , and then you got,  a little bit of a theatrical release with barely breathing, which, you know, if Neil's listening to this, he better be, , you know.

Yeah. , like it's,  that's barely great. Has played in some wonderful festivals. Yeah. And wonderful festivals. And , I didn't get to make it that night 'cause I was outta town, but at Plaza Theater, like, think about that history, you know? Oh yeah. That theater's been around since the twenties.

Like , , there's gotta be a surrealism to that. Like that's gotta be a, I made it moment, even if this is it. And at the end of the day. Nothing else happens. It's like you made it and , it's pretty incredible  to think about. Yeah. And I can remember, , 'cause we did a screening for the King for Cast and Crew in 2019 is when I actually finished making that film.

So it was in January, I think, January 26th, 2019, we screened at the Plaza for a, , opening night. , leading up to that, those four years to get to that point, I. , it was a long four years,  when we finished making that movie, filming it in 2015, ,  we'd filmed on it for the two months I began editing the film.

 And it was a lot to put together.  , it was a feature. You've got the script and you know what order it's going in. So  you've got some, you've got the direction for it, but now you gotta put it together. We had worked extensively to try and pull off how we were gonna make it feel like London.

We wanted, , lots of brick , and. Dark wood, mahogany fields  and for the cars, you know, it was a big problem shooting in the US for getting London cars and whatnot. So there's so mu there's so much logistical nightmares. There's so, yeah, it's like, it's ridiculous, dude. But , we planned to just film everything in reverse, so we had, , costumes with name tags printed backwards.

The makeup, if there was bruising, would be done on the opposite side of the face. And, , and so that when everything was flipped horizontally and posted, it looked like they were driving on. , the left side. , and the steering wheels , were on the right side of the car. And, , and that the costumes and, and everything, the costumes were made to be symmetrical for everybody.

, except for Benny, Benny Wood. All of Benny shirts were handmade spray painted. , so each of those were done backwards so that his would look correct and, , there was meticulous planning , on Julio and i's part to, to pull that off. We have it in our journal. We'd have every single, you know, down to the scene, which shots needed to be reversed because sometimes we were filming something else that day that wasn't meant to be reversed and couldn't be even sometimes.

And so we would say, okay, well this shot has to be in reverse, but that shot can't be. And you know , what's the line look like now, , for that we can't break and et cetera, et cetera. There was a lot to keep track of there. Some things were successful, some things we got in a post and realized, oh, well you fucked that up.

But, , but we were able , to wade through it. And, , editing though it was a four year process, , it took a really long time to get that film together. And I remember. I was working on it , in my free time as much as I could while waiting tables. I went back to waiting tables  and in 2016 I stopped waiting tables and went to Valeting cars.

And I remember at the beginning of 2017, I, before the film was done, I finally booked my first TV show , that being Mary Jane Show and I did the eight episodes and that gave me the money that I needed to say, I'm not waiting tables anymore. I'm gonna sit and just, I'm gonna push for acting and I'm gonna work on this film.

And that is what I did. And I booked some other TV shows that year and it kept me going and I've been able , to keep it going since then. But I was able to take that leap and say, I don't have to wait right now. I spent 60 to 80 hours a week editing on that movie in 2017.  And, I ended up having to teach myself VFX to finish that film.

I brought on Tito Alberto Matos Jr. He's worked on projects like The Expendables, the Walking Dead, many other great things. And , Tito came on board to help me. I. With a few heavy hitting VFX shots. , there's a lot of gunshots , and blood in the film. And, , there's a tito there's lovely, , BTS video still on YouTube that people Oh, up?

Yeah. Oh, oh, no kidding. Caught it. It was a really good one. Oh, okay. All right. Yeah. Well, Tito came on to help , with a couple of the VFX and, , he did about 20, 21 shots in the film. , but in total there were around. The original cut of this film. Mind you,  there are around 700 VFX shots in the film that, , Tito did 20, I did the 680, , give or take,  after that.

And, , that was once again stepping, stepping foot and saying, I don't know how to do this, but I'm gonna figure it out. Because if we had paid, . Your average rate of, , let's just say a  low ball rate of $50 per shot, , at 700 shots, , what does that even come to?

Math wise? Like 700, I don't even know. , like $35,000, something like that. Like, yeah, that blew our budget outta the water. , we just shot the thing for only seven, which went to food. . Costumes, wardrobe,  some travel stuff, , car rentals when they were needed, et cetera. And, , we couldn't afford to do that, so had to do it ourselves, , and I was editing the film and wanted it done a , specific way.

So it, it came down to me, , and maybe there would've been somebody who would've helped me, but I didn't know who they were.  Tito helped me as much as he could, but, ,  there's a, there's an extent that somebody can help you and. , and , we got the film put together and finalized and had the screening in 2019, and it was just such a big reward to see it up there on the screen at the plaza.

, I remember they were about to film zombie land too at the time, and the cast and crew for zombie land. Was there watching zombie land just before , our film. So Woody Harrelson actually came walking out in the middle of this plaza, filled with people dressed to the nines there to watch the king of bloody fucking.

I remember him walking through, just looking at everybody. He must have been high. He just walked looking at everybody like, what is going on out here? , and he just, and he left with everybody. I think he gave my buddy Mack , some Twinkies before he left, genuinely. And then he was gone. What a guy.

What a guy. And, , so I always tell people Woody Harrelson , was at the screening premier. , but,  anyway, , I found it so rewarding  and, , to see it up there, after I saw it up there, I went back and re-edited some stuff and, , and even did more VFX shots.  , when we first started submitting to festivals, , the cut was two hours long.

Of the film. I think the total runtime was two hours, five with the creds. And  , we got turned down from every single festival we submitted to every single one. , which is not a very big vote of confidence at all. No. , you're like, dang, not one all of you British accents suck. Like Yeah, , they're maybe not the greatest all across the board, but, , but I tell you what, we're having some fun  and I think 

that was kind of a little frustrating at the time, but we did get some feedback from one festival and they're like, Hey, we love this, but it's just too long. And we're like, dang, okay. So I went back and I recut the film to the hour and 36 or whatever it is now, and I don't regret doing that. I hope nobody ever sees the two hour cut.

, and only ever watches this hour and a half long bit.  And   it took another two years for us to get distribution for the film.

You know, going into making a movie. Now, I would approach things much, much differently. , I. But, , but that was a film school for me. It genuinely was.  You always hear like, if you wanna be a filmmaker, just get out there and do it. It's true. , get out there and do it. I now work professionally as a VFX artist  and professionally as an editor, and I've been hired to direct things because of having done that film.

, and that's crazy and cool. , and it always is something fun to have a scene of that on my reel when, , people watch the reel, they're like, your range is crazy. And I'm like, yeah, yeah. It's it.  And you might. You might not get the chance to play , those roles that you really want to because people just don't see you in it immediately.

And so, okay, well make something with yourself doing that , and show 'em. It's, we have to be spoonfed a little bit sometimes, , what an amazing story, man. Like, it's like, congratulations, like, I know I'm kind of late on the train, but. , what a magnificent accomplishment. Just getting it done.

And I'm sure like everyone listening to this podcast is probably out there saying the same thing. ,  I don't want to ask you like, advice to filmmakers. 'cause  I hate that. You know, I think it's needed , in some aspects , but I feel like there's plenty of videos out there for that.

But I wanna know  when you make a film, what part of it has your heart? Hmm. You know, I think  that's a wonderful question that probably I could easily overcomplicate an answer for.  But I think it really is important that when you're making a film, your heart has to be in it at every step of the way.

And you have to want, really want it because getting it done, , spike Lee said this once again,  it's a miracle that any film gets done. He's not wrong. It is requires so many moving parts and so many people, and , it's easy to make mistakes. You should welcome them, their lessons, but , it will happen.

 I, like I said,  I think it's just important , that you have your heart on every part of it, and it's not easy to do every single day, but you gotta find out how , you gotta make that happen because it's easy for it to fall apart, and it's easy for it to sit on the shelf and it's easy for 10, 15 years to pass you by and it's not done.

Well said. .  Derek, before we get outta here, let the folks know what you got going on and where they can find this film. Again for the third time. Yeah. Once again, hey, you all have already heard where you could find a film, find it or not. I would love if you watched it somewhere other than Tubi, but you don't have to.

, I love Tubi. , God bless 'em. And, , yeah, at least they're watching it. Yeah, you know what, , I'll take it from anywhere if you got to. I don't blame you, but, , but if you would rather not watch it in seven 20 p that's all I'm saying. Other than that, , barely breathing , has finished its festival circuit, which we talked about in the Brink podcast a little bit.

, barely breathing, has won 13 something, , awards,  including Audience Choice at Austin Film Festival, which was just a still over the moon on that, , in 2023.  And I think that, . , hopefully soon we'll be releasing it to the public. We're still working on the details  of how we want to approach that and where we want to actually have the film land , for forever , and whatnot.

It'd be great if you all wanted to watch something that's a, , different speed for sure than the king.  But also  a riot and a blast. And what I have next is, , something I'm working on with a, 

a co-writer, co-writer of mine, Eric Whitten, , set in the late 1960s moving through time to the early two thousands. , we're following the story of Anthony Battalion, who invented a special comb that revolutionized the hair industry. And, , it's a wild, wild ride.  Anthony Batal, his son, Stevie Batal,  is a buddy of mine.

He does hair, he's done hair for me , on several shows in town. And,, it's a wild, you know, rags, the riches, the rags story, and just an honest story  of how it's on us to swallow our generational pain. I don't know if that makes sense to a lot of people. Listening right now, but , it's a story that we're still shaping up and  I can't wait to try and bring to the screen, but it's what we're hoping to bring to the screen next.

And, , yeah. Amazing man. So I can't wait to see what you got coming down the pipe. And I know you're gonna continue to do great things. 

Derrick, thank you so much for being , on another episode. Thanks for taking the time to show us Brink. , he's about to be a dad, everybody. So I want everyone to yo less than two weeks. Yeah,  if you, how crazy the Derrick Evans on Instagram. I know that one. Send him a message.

In the meantime,  good luck in the future. , we hope to have you back on the show at some point down the road. We'll look forward to that. I hope everyone has a good rest of their day.